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{{Archives|[[/Archive 2012|2012]]|[[/Archive 2013|2013]]|[[/Archive 2014|2014]]|[[/Archive 2015|2015]]}}
{{Archives|[[/Archive 2012|2012]]|[[/Archive 2013|2013]]|[[/Archive 2014|2014]]|[[/Archive 2015|2015]]|[[/Archive 2016|2016]]}}
{{shortcut|FGW:VP}}
{{shortcut|FGW:VP}}
Welcome to the '''Village Pump'''. This page is used to discuss the technical issues, operations and guidelines of the [[FlightGear wiki]].
Welcome to the '''Village Pump'''. This page is used to discuss the technical issues, operations and guidelines of the [[FlightGear wiki]].
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Old discussion should be moved to a [[FlightGear wiki:Village pump/Archive YEAR]]. These discussions can then be moved to a relevant talk page if appropriate.
Old discussion should be moved to a [[FlightGear wiki:Village pump/Archive YEAR]]. These discussions can then be moved to a relevant talk page if appropriate.


== Welcome template? ==
== 2018 ==
I have been thinking about suggesting a welcome template, for example named {{obr}}welcome{{cbr}}, to place on top of (at least) new users user discussion pages.
=== Captcha ===
Hi all! I need to fill the captcha box for each edit or new page in this wiki. I think for registered users isn't necessary. I will be glad if its removed. Thanks
== 2017 ==
=== Build Templates ===
I only just realized that we're unnecessarily duplicating information in most build related articles by separately mentioning build dependecies instead of using a shared template, which would also be easier to update/maintain should the build requirements change (think osg 3.4), which would also mean that it would be easier to maintain correct URLs for each depenedncy, while also having a way to nicely keep dependencies for different fgfs versions - so probably a worthwile thing to do...
-[[User:Hooray|Hooray]] ([[User talk:Hooray|talk]]) 07:17, 31 December 2017 (EST)


It should welcome the (new) user
=== New Portals (Dec/2017) ===
Looking at the forum/devel list, two more portals may make sense:
* RC
* Cockpit Building


In addition, it should probably mention and/or link to pages mentioning:
Thoughts / ideas ?
* The introduction page/tutorial (Hmm, I do not think I did finish that one. See [[Help talk:Tutorial]] ([http://wiki.flightgear.org/index.php?title=Help_talk:Tutorial&oldid=70843 perm])).
* Help pages
* How to use categories (in particular not like #tags, ;-) but also that image and article categories should be separate, but link to each other)
* The portals
* The style manual
* Discussion pages and where to discuss what:
** How to use discussion pages
** The wiki in general:  The village pump (this page)
** Wiki articles:  Article discussion pages
** Wiki user actions:  User discussion pages


Maybe it should also mention that FGAddon aircraft, effects, other features etc. (except for their articles) and their bugs should be discussed on the forum, unless developers say otherwise, and that core features should be discussed on the developer mailing list and core bugs on the bug tracker.
-[[User:Hooray|Hooray]] ([[User talk:Hooray|talk]]) 10:22, 29 December 2017 (EST)


—[[User:Johan G|Johan G]] ([[User_talk:Johan_G|Talk]] | [[Special:Contributions/Johan_G|contribs]]) 20:31, 30 January 2016 (EST)
=== Newsletter templates (June/2017) ===


: I think this is a great idea. A nice concise summary with links to help a new user navigate the FlightGear jungle would be a great addition. It should however remain very short with simple sentences - while being complete - as many users are not native speakers. So maybe there should be translations of the template with manually added links at the bottom for easy access to all the translations?
Referring to Johan's comments at [https://forum.flightgear.org/viewtopic.php?f=42&t=32405&start=15#p313099]:
Is there anything we can do to unify newsletters and changelogs without requiring major additions to the wiki in the form of plugins/addons ?
Specifically, I was wondering if something along these lines would be worthwhile to discuss:


: [[User:Bugman|Bugman]] ([[User talk:Bugman|talk]]) 03:35, 12 February 2016 (EST)
* Create a basic template-based structure to add standardized announcements/news
* These would be standardized based on category (core, aircraft, scenery, canvas, Nasal etc), inspired by recent changelogs/newsletters
* Move specific text to sub-templates, so that we can easily localize/translate those using a handful of templates
* support optional screenshots/youtube links
* support optional fields to be added/excluded in a given mode (newsletter vs. changelog)


:: Regarding an introduction article, I have come to the conclusion that a complete but long article is probably not as helpful as short but specific help pages.  In essence the latter would be easier to navigate and absorb.  I have therefore started to slowly split up some of the help pages and have added one more section to [[Help:Contents]].
In other words, we would review our published newsletters and changelogs and determine the common structure that could be re-implemented in the form of templates, and then come up with a handful of templates to add items in a standardized fashion, e.g. along these lines:
:: I think that a welcome phrase, a link to that page and the [[FlightGear wiki:Manual of Style|style manual]] might actually suffice for a welcome template for now.  It is at least better than what we currently have (i.e. more or less nothing).
:: —[[User:Johan G|Johan G]] ([[User_talk:Johan_G|Talk]] | [[Special:Contributions/Johan_G|contribs]]) 14:47, 4 March 2016 (EST)


:: I now consider
* category
::* A Welcome message
* new/updated/removed feature
::* A link to this page
* headline
::* A link to the help pages
* common text
::* A link to the manual of style
* changelog specific text
::* Some final welcoming words
* newsletter specific text
* screenshots
* videos
* link for additional information


:: A welcome template should probably also very briefly mention a pet peeve of mine: the categories.
Something like this could be easily implemented without much wiki magic, and it could be also easily translated at the template level
:: Many (if not most) image uploaders seem to treat them like tags, but if say all screenshots of aircraft (probably >2000) would end up at [[:Category:Aircraft]] (instead of under a subcategory to [[:Category:Screenshots of aircraft]]), of what use would that page be when looking for a specific one?  If people would like to be able to search for an aircraft, a concise but comprehensive image description is very hard to beat.
:: How do I convey all that in a way that is, short, to the point and easy to absorb (and act by)? And where is the best place?
:: —[[User:Johan G|Johan G]] ([[User_talk:Johan_G|Talk]] | [[Special:Contributions/Johan_G|contribs]]) 02:46, 8 March 2016 (EST)


:: An early draft is now at [[User:Johan G/Template:Welcome to the wiki]]
Thoughts / ideas ?
:: —[[User:Johan G|Johan G]] ([[User_talk:Johan_G|Talk]] | [[Special:Contributions/Johan_G|contribs]]) 02:52, 18 April 2016 (EDT)


::: Some comments on the draft:
-[[User:Hooray|Hooray]] ([[User talk:Hooray|talk]]) 06:40, 2 July 2017 (EDT)
::: * I'm not fully sure about using a prominent box - I think it stands out a bit too much. Wikipedia {{wikipedia|Template:Welcome|uses a simple thread on the Talk page}}; as an alternative, we could use lighter colors.
::: * I've also expanded the text a bit. My proposal would be (I've put it in a box, but I'm for the "thread" solution):
<div style="background: #fff; border: 1px #585858 solid; padding: 12px; margin: 12px">
[[Image:Example.png|left]] '''Welcome to the FlightGear wiki, {{#if: {{{name|}}} | {{{name}}} | {{BASEPAGENAME}}}}'''! We hope you will enjoy your stay!


See [[Help:Contents#Reading|Reading]] to learn how wikis work. You can also [[Special:CategoryTree/Root category|browse the existing page categories]].
: I will start slightly off topic with that I actually consider the current newsletter format to be slightly more complicated than it really needs to be. This is mostly due to the handcrafted table of contents replacing the automatically added one.  If we go back a few years a wiki newsletter page was done exactly as any other wiki page using the same way to add headers and with an automatically generated table of contents.


Should you wish to create or edit some articles, ''do so''! Here are some resources to get you started:
: To illustrate the above, compare the [http://wiki.flightgear.org/index.php?title=FlightGear_Newsletter_January_2010&action=edit|January 2010 newsletter] (plain article style, one template for the header), the intermediate [http://wiki.flightgear.org/index.php?title=FlightGear_Newsletter_January_2011&action=edit|January 2011 newsletter] (one additional template to move the ToC right and change the text flow) and the later [http://wiki.flightgear.org/index.php?title=FlightGear_Newsletter_January_2015&action=edit|January 2015 newsletter] (discarding the automatic ToC for a handcrafted one using a template for each main section and subsections added by hand.) Even if that is only so much resistance, it can be what stops a contributor.
* [[Help:Contents#Editing|How to edit pages]]
* [[Help:Discussion pages|Discussion pages]], where we discuss and agree on potential improvements
* [[FlightGear wiki:Manual of Style|The Manual of Style]], a set of guidelines to help editors maintain a consistent style and formatting (please follow them)
* [[Help:Contents|Wiki help page]]


If you have any questions, just start a topic on the [[FlightGear wiki:Village pump|''Discuss!'' page]]. Again, welcome!
: What I was referring to with
</div>
: {{cquote|I think it would be technically possible to make templates that could simplify adding new newsletter blanks (but I have said that for years without doing anything about it :oops: ).}}
::: ...where the image on the left is an appropriately chosen icon.
: was that one can make templates that will import a page blank prepared with regular sections and subsections (that technique have been used on English Wikipedia for adding template documentation.)
::: Finally, we could use the {{mediawiki|Extension:NewUserMessage|NewUserMessage extension}} to have the wiki software automatically post the message to the new user's talk page.
::: ---- [[User:Elgaton|ElGaton]] ([[User talk:Elgaton|<tt>talk</tt> to me]]) 17:30, 1 May 2016 (EDT)


== Permanently removing spam bots ==
: In essence such a newsletter blank could have some of this prepared and some commented out suggestions for how to add a new section and how to add images and embedded videos etc.
For permanently removing spam bots, has the [https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Extension:UserMerge UserMerge] Mediawiki extension been considered?  I use that regularly on [http://wiki.nmr-relax.com my own wiki], though there we have also reverted to communicating to the person via email before manually granting access (probably not an option here), as all of the Mediawiki captcha methods were recently cracked.


[[User:Bugman|Bugman]] ([[User talk:Bugman|talk]]) 03:15, 12 February 2016 (EST)
: —[[User:Johan G|Johan G]] ([[User_talk:Johan_G|Talk]] | [[Special:Contributions/Johan_G|contribs]]) 09:14, 3 September 2017 (EDT)


: Oh, for the extension, we simply have a user called 'Spam bot' in a blocked state, and merge the spam bot accounts into this one, deleting the old account.
::: I found my way back to some documentation on what I mentioned above.[https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Manual:Parameters_to_index.php#Edit_and_submit][https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Manual:Creating_pages_with_preloaded_text]
: [[User:Bugman|Bugman]] ([[User talk:Bugman|talk]]) 03:20, 12 February 2016 (EST)


:: I'd use the [https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Extension:AbuseFilter abuse filter extension] instead (much more powerful and automated) - other users have also proposed different remedies, see [http://forum.flightgear.org/viewtopic.php?f=42&t=28734 this forum thread]. Anyway, Gijs is going to upgrade MediaWiki shortly and review the current anti-spam measures.
::: One would basically make a subpage to the template (say <tt><nowiki>{{Newsletter-new}}</nowiki></tt>) with the text to be preloaded (which is the term used) on the subpage (<tt>Template:Newsletter-new/Newsletter_blank</tt>) and link to it like this <tt><nowiki>http://wiki.flightgear.org/index.php?title=FlightGear_Newsletter_<month>_<year>&action=edit&preload=Template:Newsletter-new/Newsletter_blank</nowiki></tt>.
:: -- [[User:Elgaton|ElGaton]] ([[User talk:Elgaton|<tt>talk</tt> to me]]) 06:26, 13 February 2016 (EST)


::: A lot of the spam bots are using their name as advertising nowadays, so the [https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Extension:UserMerge UserMerge] extension is the only one I know which will allow a user and associated name to be permanently deleted.
:::The new newsletter template could simply have a link "Click here to create the next newsletter". It needs to be on another page than the newsletter itself though, for example on a page describing how to contribute to the newsletter.


::: [[User:Bugman|Bugman]] ([[User talk:Bugman|talk]]) 12:04, 14 February 2016 (EST)
::: [[User:Johan G|Johan G]] ([[User_talk:Johan_G|Talk]] | [[Special:Contributions/Johan_G|contribs]]) 09:43, 3 September 2017 (EDT)


:::: The problem now is that they're also adding the information to the page title, so that it will still show up in the deletion logs [http://wiki.flightgear.org/Special:Log/delete] in other words, there's still some SEO juice associated with deleted entries ... Another idea would be to allow admins to temporarily disable wiki registrations/article creation, e.g. if more than 2 admins agree, this could be done to protect the wiki from spam attacks.
:: I totally agree, while I appreciate the appearance of the new newsletter template, I always found it cumbersome/tedious to actually edit the newsletter compared to the old way. And I am all for automation. Then again, we have been suggesting/requesting certain plugins to be installed, but unfortunately to no avail so far. Speaking in general, it would be great if we could identify some of the recurring tasks on the wiki and find a way to automate most of these. For instance, being able to add contents to one page that shows up on other pages would also be useful, as this could greatly simplify writing the changelog - imagine adding stuff to the newsletter, which is then automagically added to the proper changelog. However, as usual it seems manpower is our primary constraint, Curt does not seem to have the corresponding privileges here and Gijs is basically n/a these days. What is really needed is an additional wiki admin, someone with Simon's privileges. And I would suggest we nominate bugman for that position :-)  - [[User:Hooray|Hooray]] ([[User talk:Hooray|talk]])


::::: Hooray, you should sign your posts ;)  The bots don't target the deletion logs, as that's a little pointless. It's a Special:* page, and the default Mediawiki robots.txt file tells all search engines to not index these pages.  User pages, page histories, etc. are however normally indexed.
::: Yikes, this actually works: http://wiki.flightgear.org/index.php?title=FlightGear_Newsletter_November_2020&action=edit&preload=Talk:Next_newsletter -[[User:Hooray|Hooray]] ([[User talk:Hooray|talk]])


::::: [[User:Bugman|Bugman]] ([[User talk:Bugman|talk]]) 14:36, 19 February 2016 (EST)
:::: An early newsletter template draft is now available in my sandbox.
:::: —[[User:Johan G|Johan G]] ([[User_talk:Johan_G|Talk]] | [[Special:Contributions/Johan_G|contribs]]) 07:09, 11 November 2017 (EST)


:: The point was not what the bots are targeting, but what shows up in the logs - i.e. SEO-wise - Gijs' article blacklist stuff should help with that hopefully. PS: I could not find the signature button on the mobile device I am using, and I am not too good at remembering the correct number of tildes ;-) [[User:Hooray|Hooray]] ([[User talk:Hooray|talk]]) 15:04, 19 February 2016 (EST)
:::: I got around to polish it a bit more now: [[User:Johan G/Template:This months newsletter]]
:::: —[[User:Johan G|Johan G]] ([[User_talk:Johan_G|Talk]] | [[Special:Contributions/Johan_G|contribs]]) 12:32, 19 November 2017 (EST)


== WIP vs. Under construction ==
::::hi! If you Johan that you're more experienced can prepare Newsletter templates and pages to facilitate translations without need to create descentralised templates and duplicated pages, it would be nice and step forward to non English-speaker users. What you think about be able to do it for December Newsletter? Thank you so much for your work for templates, pages and the wiki!--[[User:Catalanoic|Catalanoic]] ([[User talk:Catalanoic|talk]]) 13:15, 10 December 2017 (EST)
I have been beginning to miss the under construction template[http://wiki.flightgear.org/index.php?title=Template:Under_Construction&direction=prev&oldid=46229] more and more (though I could it definitively could be improved).


I have begun to appreciate the need to differentiate between letting readers that a page is to be considered a yet to be finished construction site (though we in a way have that through the {{tl|incomplete}} template) and letting the reader (and other editors) that a page will receive a large amount of work for some hours or even days, usually the use for {{tl|WIP}}.
::::: Sorry for the late reply.


In summary i miss templates giving a clear distinction between conditions akin to "Under construction" and "Caution - Wet floors", rather than "being worked on" and "could need more work".
::::: ''Yes'', a centralized newsletter can be done rather easily.  We could add {{tl|LangSwitch}} templates to the sections in the newsletter template (hopefully users adding other sections to a particular newsletter will see what is going on and copy it).  It should then be a matter of creating an empty page with a language prefix and [[Help:Glossary#T|transclude]] the newsletter there as if it was a template.


—[[User:Johan G|Johan G]] ([[User_talk:Johan_G|Talk]] | [[Special:Contributions/Johan_G|contribs]]) 10:11, 17 February 2016 (EST)
::::: ''The downsides'' are that the newsletter will be more complicated to edit (raising the threshold for new editors and stopping a few of them), that we most likely will not be able to edit just a section (as the section headings will need to be in the language templates as the need to be translated as well), and that the page will be larger to retrieve as you will always download all languages to view or edit the page.  I do not think it will be worth it.


== [[Fr/Pilote automatique]] ==
::::: ''However'', if we get to the point that we have a template preloading a newsletter blank as discussed earlier in this topic (which seems very likely), we should probably have one for each of the languages someone can translate it to.  I think it would be much, much better to centralize this template.
Bonjour,


Je viens de créer la page de traduction en français de l'article original en anglais [[Autopilot]]. Vu mes faibles compétences en matière de pilotage, vu que je n'ai pas sur ma version téléchargée d'avion avec un pilote automatique, la traduction doit souffrir quelques approximations, si ce n'est des contresens plus ennuyeux. Si quelques bonnes âmes plus qualifiées pouvaient me faire la grâce d'une relecture... merci d'avance.
::::: ''In short:'' With the approach above the newsletter can be made so that there is a centralized version. But I do not think it is worth the large downsides and think that would be better to instead have a centralized template preloading a newsletter blank for a specific language.


Cordialement, et Hop ! --[[User:F-WTSS|F-WTSS]] ([[User talk:F-WTSS|talk]]) 15:30, 18 February 2016 (EST)
::::: —[[User:Johan G|Johan G]] ([[User_talk:Johan_G|Talk]] | [[Special:Contributions/Johan_G|contribs]]) 23:48, 21 July 2018 (EDT)


== MediaWiki updated to 1.26.2 ==
:::::: Hi, currently the German newsletter gets translated like every normal article here on a new page. Works great. I don't think the newsletter would benefit from a centralised Newsletter using {{tl|LangSwitch}} as
I've updated MediaWiki to the latest stable release (1.26.2) today. I've still got to update some of the extensions, so there may be regressions for now. Please report bugs if you find any. For a list of changes, see https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Release_notes/1.26
::::::* you also need to create a <nowiki>[[Es/FG News Marzo 2019]]</nowiki> page every month to view the translated content on it
::::::* it invites to write a new article in your language and we need to find someone to translate it back to english
::::::* wiki code already is a challenge for new authors, LangSwitch would make it even worse!
:::::: My [[User:Skybike#Wiki_Sandbox|sandbox experiments]] take another approach:
::::::*There is a ''draft to prelaod'' called ''Newsletter Example'' in [[User:Skybike/Template:This months newsletter/Newsletter example|English]] and another one in [[User:Skybike/Template:This months newsletter/De/Newslettervorlage|German]]
::::::*A {{obr}}[[User:Skybike/Template:This months newsletter|This months newsletter]]{{cbr}} template selects the language based on {{tl|LangSwitch}} or the parameter "lang=". (When typing <code>{{obr}}<small>:User:Skybike/Template:</small>This months newsletter{{cbr}}</code> on a german page like [[de/Hauptseite]] it preloads the [[User:Skybike/Template:This months newsletter/De/Newslettervorlage|German Newsletter Example]] to create the current German newsletter [[de/FlightGear Newsletter Juni 2018]])
::::::*As Catalanoic mentioned {{tl|Newsletter-header}} got translated into the descentralised template {{tl|De/Newsletter-header}} long time ago. In my sandbox is a new header {{obr}}[[User:Skybike/Template:Newsletter-header-translate|Newsletter-header-translate]]{{cbr}}. It uses {{tl|LangSwitch}} and the obove preload templates. (Its down compartible to {{tl|Newsletter-header}})
::::::All these templates should work. Like <code>{{obr}}<small>:User:Skybike/Template:</small>This months newsletter|date=2018-11{{cbr}}</code> {{:User:Skybike/Template:This months newsletter|subpage-to=User:DeleteMe|date=2018-11}} and by adding <code>lang=de</code>: {{:User:Skybike/Template:This months newsletter|subpage-to=User:DeleteMe|date=2018-11|lang=de}}.
::::::Legoboyvdlp already created [[FlightGear Newsletter September 2018‎]] with it.(Surprised me, need to change the header template there as it links to my sandbox) Note the "create next edition" in the upper right of the header there. But temporarily a new language could use my sandbox as well, just create a new newsletter blank and translate [[User:Skybike/Template:This months newsletter|This months newsletter]] and [[User:Skybike/Template:Newsletter-header-translate|Newsletter-header-translate]].
::::::[[User:Skybike|Skybike]] ([[User talk:Skybike|talk]]) 10:10, 22 July 2018 (EDT)


[[User:Gijs|Gijs]] ([[User talk:Gijs|talk]]) 10:47, 19 February 2016 (EST)
== Using Template:Convert ==


: Cheers!  I was hoping that it would solve the uneditable Chinese, Russian, and other non-latin character-based pages (Polish strangely as well), but unfortunately [[FlightGear_wiki:Village_pump/Archive_2015#UTF-8_language_pages_cannot_be_edited|that issue remains]].
while looking at the [[Lockheed_Martin_F-35B_Lightning_II]], I noted the use of units that we could automatically have converted for us using the [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Template:Convert convert template] from wikipedia... i'm assuming that we can do that, right? so below is an example of how it would be used and how it would look... i've left the original entry in place for final result comparison...


: [[User:Bugman|Bugman]] ([[User talk:Bugman|talk]]) 10:54, 19 February 2016 (EST)
<syntaxhighlight>
 
=== Performance Data ===
:: Hm, looks that will require quite some attention indeed. I'm afraid that'll has to wait for now.
* '''Maximum Speed:''' 1,200 mph {{convert|1200|mph|kt|abbr=on}}
:: [[User:Gijs|Gijs]] ([[User talk:Gijs|talk]]) 12:29, 19 February 2016 (EST)
* '''Rate of climb:''' classified
 
* '''Service Ceiling:''' 60,000 ft {{convert|60000|ft|m|abbr=on}}
=== Nasal Syntaxhighlighting ===
* '''Range:''' 1,200 mi {{convert|1200|mi|km|abbr=on}}
: Thanks for your efforts, btw: Nasal syntax highlighting is gone again.
: {{unsigned|17:22, 19 February 2016‎|Hooray}}
 
:: Unfortunately this time it isn't me forgetting to copy a file. The SyntaxHighlight extension no longer uses GeSHi, but has switched to Pygments. This means our Nasal mapping no longer works and has to be re-written. If anyone is interested, be my guest. See http://pygments.org/docs/lexerdevelopment/
:: [[User:Gijs|Gijs]] ([[User talk:Gijs|talk]]) 12:29, 19 February 2016 (EST)
 
::: Hi Gijs,
::: I'm interested in making a Pygments Nasal lexer, but unfortunately I won't be able to work on it until the end of March at the earliest.
::: [[User:Red_Leader|<span style="color:red">'''''Red Leader'''''</span>]] ([[User_talk:Red_Leader|Talk]], [[Special:Contributions/Red_Leader|contribs]]) 16:59, 23 February 2016 (EST)
 
:::: Unless Gijs is facing any problems, I don't think it's necessarily needed, see my comment/suggestion in this revision: [http://wiki.flightgear.org/index.php?title=FlightGear_wiki:Village_pump&oldid=93166] [[User:Hooray|Hooray]] ([[User talk:Hooray|talk]]) 17:20, 23 February 2016 (EST)
 
:::Hi Gijs,
:::Here's the code for a Nasal lexer. Be warned, it's thoroughly untested, but has the following features:
:::* Full support for all three string types (backtick, single quote, and double quote), including escapes and formatting strings (e.g., for {{func link|sprintf}}).
:::* All kinds of numbers, including numbers in scientific notation and octal and hex numbers.
:::* All global functions and variables as of FG v2016.1.1.
:::* Some of the commonly-used <code>props.Node</code> methods.
:::* All the other things that can be expected (keywords, punctuation, etc.).
:::I have also created a lexer based on the XML lexer for XML with embedded Nasal, which I thought would be useful.
:::Regards,
:::[[User:Red_Leader|<span style="color:red">'''''Red Leader'''''</span>]] ([[User_talk:Red_Leader|Talk]], [[Special:Contributions/Red_Leader|contribs]]) 16:35, 2 April 2016 (EDT)
 
:::http://pygments.org/docs/lexerdevelopment/#adding-and-testing-a-new-lexer
:::<syntaxhighlight lang="python" enclose="div">
# -*- coding: utf-8 -*-
"""
Lexer for Nasal.
"""
 
from pygments.lexer import RegexLexer, words, include, inherit, bygroups, using
from pygments.token import Text, Keyword, Name, String, Number, Operator, Punctuation, Comment
from pygments.lexers.html import XmlLexer
 
__all__ = ['NasalLexer', 'XMLNasalLexer']
 
class NasalLexer(RegexLexer):
 
name = 'Nasal'
aliases = ['nasal']
filenames = ['*.nas']
 
tokens = {
'formatters': [
(r'%[-#0 +]*(?:[0-9]+)?(?:\.[0-9]+)?[dis%couxXeEfFgG]', String.Interpol),
],
'backtick': [
(r'`', String.Backtick, '#pop'),
(r'[^`\\]+', String.Backtick),
(r'\\n|\\r|\\t|\\`|\\\\|\\x[0-9a-fA-F]{2}', String.Escape),
],
'sqstring': [
(r"'", String.Single, '#pop'),
(r"[^'\\%]+", String.Single),
(r"\\'", String.Escape),
include('formatters'),
],
'dqstring': [
(r'"', String.Double, '#pop'),
(r'[^"\\%]+', String.Double),
(r'\\n|\\r|\\t|\\"|\\\\|\\x[0-9a-fA-F]{2}', String.Escape),
include('formatters'),
],
'root': [
(r'\s+', Text),
(r'#.*?$'m, Comment.Single),
(r':|\?|[!=<>+\-*\/~&|^]=?', Operator),
(words(('or', 'and'), suffix=r'\b'), Operator.Word),
(r'[{(\[})\]\.;,]', Punctuation),
(words(('for', 'foreach', 'forindex', 'while', 'break', 'return', 'continue', 'if', 'else', 'elsif'), suffix=r'\b'), Keyword),
(words(('var', 'func'), suffix=r'\b'), Keyword.Declaration),
(words(('nil'), suffix=r'\b'), Keyword.Constant),
(words(('me', 'arg'), suffix=r'\b'), Name.Builtin.Pseudo),
(words(('new', 'del', 'getNode', 'getParent', 'getChild', 'getChildren', 'removeChild', 'removeChildren', 'removeAllChildren', 'getName', 'getIndex', 'getType', 'getAttribute', 'setAttribute', 'getValue', 'setValue', 'setIntValue', 'setBoolValue', 'setDoubleValue', 'unalias', 'alias', 'getPath', 'getBoolValue', 'remove', 'setValues', 'getValues', 'initNode'), suffix=r'\b'), Keyword.Pseudo),
(r'0o[0-7]+', Number.Oct),
(r'0x[0-9a-fA-F]+', Number.Hex),
(r'\d*(?:\.\d*)?[eE][+-]?\d+', Number.Float),
(r'\d*\.\d*', Number.Float),
(r'\b[0-9]+\b', Number.Integer),
(words(('D2R', 'R2D', 'FT2M', 'M2FT', 'IN2M', 'M2IN', 'NM2M', 'M2NM', 'KT2MPS', 'MPS2KT', 'FPS2KT', 'KT2FPS', 'LB2KG', 'KG2LB', 'GAL2L', 'L2GAL'), suffix=r'\b'), Name.Variable.Global),
(words(('abort', 'abs', 'addcommand', 'airportinfo', 'airwaysRoute', 'assert', 'carttogeod', 'cmdarg', 'courseAndDistance', 'createViaTo', 'createDiscontinuity', 'createWP', 'createWPFrom', 'defined', 'directory', 'fgcommand', 'findAirportsByICAO', 'findAirportsWithinRange', 'findFixesByID', 'findNavaidByFrequency', 'findNavaidsByFrequency', 'findNavaidsByID', 'findNavaidsWithinRange', 'finddata', 'flightplan', 'geodinfo', 'geodtocart', 'getprop', 'greatCircleMove', 'interpolate', 'isa', 'logprint', 'magvar', 'maketimer', 'md5', 'navinfo', 'parse_markdown', 'parsexml', 'print', 'printf', 'printlog', 'rand', 'registerFlightPlanDelegate', 'removecommand', 'removelistener', 'resolvepath', 'setlistener', 'setprop', 'settimer', 'srand', 'systime', 'thisfunc', 'tileIndex', 'tilePath', 'values'), suffix=r'\b'), Name.Builtin),
(words(('append', 'bind', 'call', 'caller', 'chr', 'closure', 'cmp', 'compile', 'contains', 'delete', 'die', 'find', 'ghosttype', 'id', 'int', 'keys', 'left', 'num', 'pop', 'right', 'setsize', 'size', 'sort', 'split', 'sprintf', 'streq', 'substr', 'subvec', 'typeof'), suffix=r'\b'), Name.Builtin),
(words(('_createCondition', '_fgcommand', '_interpolate', '_setlistener'), suffix=r'\b'), Keyword.Reserved),
(r'`', String.Backtick, 'backtick'),
(r"'", String.Single, 'sqstring'),
(r'"', String.Double 'dqstring'),
(r'\b_\w*?\b', Keyword.Reserved),
#(r'\b\w*?\b', Name),
]
}
 
class XMLNasalLexer(XmlLexer):
"""
For Nasal code embedded in XML files.
"""
 
name = 'XML-Nasal'
aliases = ['xml-nasal', 'xml-ns']
 
tokens = {
'root': [
(r'(<(?:load|unload|script)>)(<!\[CDATA\[)?(.*?)(]]>)?(</(?:load|unload|script)>)', bygroups(Name.Tag, Comment.Preproc, using(NasalLexer), Comment.Preproc, Name.Tag),
inherit,
],
}
</syntaxhighlight>
</syntaxhighlight>


:: We can use the ECMAScript/JavaScript lexer[http://pygments.org/docs/lexers/#lexers-for-javascript-and-related-languages] for now, my suggestion would be to copy that over to a file so that we can work on a custom Nasal lexer (Syntax  is almost identical, with a few different keywords, and many others being irrelevant). What is missing/different can be obtained from other lexers that are similar, e.g. [http://pygments.org/docs/lexers/#lexers-for-other-c-like-languages] [[User:Hooray|Hooray]] ([[User talk:Hooray|talk]]) 15:45, 19 February 2016 (EST)
::=== Performance Data ===
 
::* '''Maximum Speed:''' 1,200 mph {{convert|1200|mph|kt|abbr=on}}
:: Okay, here's the better/quick&easy way: We have Nasal support for some fairly popular editors, like [http://wiki.flightgear.org/Howto:Syntax_highlighting_for_Nasal#Vim|vim](originally created by Melchior<ref>https://sourceforge.net/p/flightgear/flightgear/ci/next/tree/scripts/syntax/nasal.vim</ref>), listed at [[Howto:Syntax_highlighting_for_Nasal]] - there are various free converters available that will read such a syntaxhighlighting file and convert it to a pygments class, e.g. see: https://github.com/honza/vim2pygments [[User:Hooray|Hooray]] ([[User talk:Hooray|talk]]) 16:00, 19 February 2016 (EST)
::* '''Rate of climb:''' classified
 
::* '''Service Ceiling:''' 60,000 ft {{convert|60000|ft|m|abbr=on}}
==== References ====
::* '''Range:''' 1,200 mi {{convert|1200|mi|km|abbr=on}}
<references />
 
== The repository link templates ==
=== Complete overhaul of the repository link templates ===
 
I have now performed a complete overhaul of the repository link templates (see {{tl|repo link/doc related}}).  This was motivated by the incomplete state of these templates, the lack of standardisation, the lack of SourceForge git repository support for {{tl|repo link}}, web-interface only support, etc.  I have used a lot of recursive transclusion for standardisation, so that there is a single point for updating for any FlightGear infrastructure changes.  This is the master {{tl|repo link}} template.  All the other templates are subtemplates which recursively transclude from this master template.  I have also created a number of documentation templates for simplifying template maintenance (see {{tl|repo link/doc related‎}}, {{tl|repo link/doc specific file git‎‎}}, {{tl|repo link/doc git clone‎‎}}, and {{tl|repo link/doc commit}}).  The changes were constrained to maintain backwards compatibility as much as possible.  However I would like to break this to allow the following templates to be updated to transclude from the master {{tl|repo link}} template:
 
* {{tl|flightgear file}},
* {{tl|simgear file}},
* {{tl|fgdata file}},
* {{tl|fgaddon file}}.
 
If no one objects, I would like to completely break these and expand and rename the parameter set to match the other <nowiki>{{* file}}</nowiki> repository templates (e.g. {{tl|terragear file}}).  My overhaul currently does not include Hooray's ideas for non command line usages, i.e. different GUIs, but it enables it to be easily added via the master template and the addition of a single parameter to any subtemplates.
 
[[User:Bugman|Bugman]] ([[User talk:Bugman|talk]]) 15:05, 25 February 2016 (EST)
 
: I don't have any objections myself, I appreciate all the work you are putting into this, and would like to thank you for helping us clean up all that mess by doing such unglamorous work ;-) I also appreciate that your changes would facilitate adding a non-CLI mode to the corresponding templates. However, I would suggest to wait for Gijs' feedback, because he's ultimately the most likely person to veto something around here ;-) [[User:Hooray|Hooray]] ([[User talk:Hooray|talk]]) 17:31, 25 February 2016 (EST)
 
:: Johan seems to be the one who did a lot of the initial work on these <nowiki>{{* file}}</nowiki> templates, and Red Leader with the {{tl|repo link}} template.  And they were involved in the general discussions ([[http://wiki.flightgear.org/index.php?title=FlightGear_wiki:Village_pump&oldid=87148#Repository_link_templates perm]).  But I know Gijs was also involved in the design.
 
:: For the non-CLI mode, that will need -a lot- more planning.  For example a definitive list of all these modes would be useful.  Should this use an optional Mediawiki pop up extension showing a link to a general page that describes the action for all different GUIs, CLI, etc.?  Should we have a switch box so that the reader can switch in-text between CLI, and the numerous GUIs?  Are we going to have a large set of screenshots for each GUI?  If so, I would strongly recommend the [https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Extension:Labeled_Section_Transclusion labelled section transclusion extension] for creating a single page for one GUI with everything for that GUI, as a tutorial.  Here is [http://wiki.nmr-relax.com/Relax_4.0.1 an external example where I have used this], to fragment the base release page to create [http://wiki.nmr-relax.com/Relax_release_descriptions this meta page], as well as many other meta pages.
 
:: [[User:Bugman|Bugman]] ([[User talk:Bugman|talk]]) 03:14, 26 February 2016 (EST)
 
I am also thinking of changing the name of the <nowiki>{{* file}}</nowiki> templates, as I hope to make the scope of the templates far more general.  The name <nowiki>{{* source}}</nowiki> or <nowiki>{{* repo}}</nowiki> might be better.  For example these will allow the repository commit, tree view, log view (and maybe rss feed), with or without a file/directory path.  And I would like to generalise this to handle both the SF web-interface and non-web net protocols (git://, ssh://, svn://, etc.).  It will allow for CLI instructions to be built up and embedded in <nowiki>{{#tag:source|<content>|lang=sh}}</nowiki> tags.  And I will defer all infrastructure decisions in the subtemplates to the single point of {{tl|project infrastructure}}, so that if there are changes in the future, then only this single template needs to be updated to update the entire wiki.
 
[[User:Bugman|Bugman]] ([[User talk:Bugman|talk]]) 03:22, 26 February 2016 (EST)
 
: The {{tl|project infrastructure}} template as a single point provider of various project infrastructure names and URL pairs seem like a great idea.  If it work out well it will really lessen the maintenance by having less places needing updates, while allowing the various repository templates to be simple to use, in essence by having comprehensible names and no boiler plate parameters for their users.
: —[[User:Johan G|Johan G]] ([[User_talk:Johan_G|Talk]] | [[Special:Contributions/Johan_G|contribs]]) 15:15, 27 February 2016 (EST)
 
==== Repository link update ====
For those following, I have massively expanded the capabilities of the {{tl|repo link}} template:
* The SourceForge URLs are now comprehensive.
* Full support for the new query-based URLs for the Gitorious archives.
* Functional GitLab URLs.
* Generic repository support (used to create the {{tl|openscenegraph co}} template).
* Detailed documentation and extensive examples for checking the implementation (if you find any non-supported links, please add these as examples).
* Isolation of the '''cmd''' parameter from the CLI options &mdash; this is to enable future support for non-CLI instructions based on the value of '''cmd'''.
 
I have also completed a large set of subtemplates of {{tl|repo link}}, see the list at {{tl|repo link/doc related}}.  This includes a full set of <nowiki>{{* source}}</nowiki> templates.  I have left the original <nowiki>{{* file}}</nowiki> templates, rather than renaming and modifying them, so these are now redundant.  All of the <nowiki>{{* source}}</nowiki>, <nowiki>{{* commit}}</nowiki>, <nowiki>{{* clone}}</nowiki>, and <nowiki>{{* co}}</nowiki> templates transclude from the master {{tl|repo link}} template to do all of the work.
 
One important template is {{tl|gitorious source}}.  The support for the new query-based URLs for the Gitorious archives is now quite comprehensive in {{tl|repo link}}.  Therefore I have converted almost every single FlightGear wiki link to https://gitorious.org to use {{tl|gitorious source}} instead.  This fixes a lot of broken links and broken git instructions.  I have reduced the number of hits for gitorious.org on the wiki (searching just for "gitorious") to 22 hits.  This includes 2 very outdated articles ([[FlightGear Git: aircraft authors]], [[Fr/FlightGear et Git]]), 15 locked newsletters, 1 with no longer existent Gitorious merge request links, and 4 base URL links for Hangars.  This way we can maintain the Gitorious web interface links and git command instructions in a functional state by simply updating the single source of {{tl|repo link}}.
 
[[User:Bugman|Bugman]] ([[User talk:Bugman|talk]]) 11:38, 29 February 2016 (EST)
 
: I just remembered [[Special:LinkSearch]], so make that 184 broken gitorious.org links remaining.  Lots more work to do :)
 
: [[User:Bugman|Bugman]] ([[User talk:Bugman|talk]]) 14:46, 29 February 2016 (EST)
 
For some of these templates, e.g. {{tl|repo link/doc usage}}, I'm trying to implement some logic for automatic whitespace padding for documentation formatting, but the <code><nowiki>{{#len:string}}</nowiki></code> function is not enabled.  According to {{mediawiki|Wikitext_parser/Core_parser_functions#.23len}} and {{mediawiki|Extension:StringFunctions}}, the option <code>$wgPFEnableStringFunctions = true;</code> should be set (in <code>LocalSettings.php</code>).  Unless there is a reason for not using this, I was wondering if someone could enable this?  Cheers!
 
[[User:Bugman|Bugman]] ([[User talk:Bugman|talk]]) 09:53, 8 March 2016 (EST)
 
=== Archived newsletters and dead links? ===
 
Do we have a policy for the dead links in the FlightGear newsletters?  It is obviously good to preserve the historic state.  But there are many Gitorious links that could be made functional again using the {{tl|gitorious source}} template to point to the historic Gitorious archives (including the official FlightGear repositories, rather than using {{tl|fgdata source}}, for example).  The https://gitorious.org links have been converted from URL/path based to query based, so absolutely all of the old links are broken.  I am steadily converting all Gitorious links to use the [[Template:repo link/doc related|{{obr}}repo link{{cbr}} family of templates]], with the exception of the newsletters.
 
[[User:Bugman|Bugman]] ([[User talk:Bugman|talk]]) 04:52, 8 March 2016 (EST)
 
: I think it could be a good idea to try update old links in those newsletters.  I sometimes look back at things and tend to think that I probably are not the only one doing that.
: I wonder if the rotten links should be replaced or stricken, but I think they could just as well be replaced.  The key thing is that they go to the same resource or content, not weather they have been updated or not (also, the change will be visible in the revision history after all).
: —[[User:Johan G|Johan G]] ([[User_talk:Johan_G|Talk]] | [[Special:Contributions/Johan_G|contribs]]) 07:11, 8 March 2016 (EST)
 
:: I should add that I'm using [http://wiki.flightgear.org/index.php?title=Special:LinkSearch&limit=500&offset=0&target=http%3A%2F%2Fgitorious.org <nowiki>Special:LinkSearch for http://gitorious.org</nowiki>] and [http://wiki.flightgear.org/index.php?title=Special:LinkSearch&limit=500&offset=0&target=https%3A%2F%2Fgitorious.org <nowiki>Special:LinkSearch for https://gitorious.org</nowiki>].  And I am also not touching the <code>User*</code> pages, <code>*talk*</code> pages, or pages tagged as out of date or up for deletion.  For the newsletters I might look at these later when the broken Gitorious links are fixed in the rest of the wiki but, as these are locked, someone else might have make the switch to {{tl|gitorious source}}, {{tl|gitorious url}}, {{tl|gitorious clone}}, and {{tl|gitorious merge request}}.
 
:: [[User:Bugman|Bugman]] ([[User talk:Bugman|talk]]) 02:53, 9 March 2016 (EST)
 
::: I will temporarily add a table here for the templates in the newsletters and will slowly fix them one by one together with any other admin.
{{navbox
| title = Click "show" to show -->
| state = collapsed
| navbar = plain
| list1 =
http:...
{{{!}} class="wikitable"
! Fixed !! Newsletter !! Gitorious URL !! Notes
{{!-}}
{{!}} {{tick}}
{{!}} [[FlightGear Newsletter May 2010]]
{{!}} http://gitorious.org/fg
{{!}} No equivalent link for the Gitorious archive - project pages are dead.  Maybe just use http://gitorious.org/?
{{!-}}
{{!}} {{tick}}
{{!}} [[Es/FlightGear Newsletter May 2010]]
{{!}} http://gitorious.org/fg
{{!-}}
{{!}} {{tick}}
{{!}} [[FlightGear Newsletter September 2010]]
{{!}} http://gitorious.org/fg/flightgear/commit/5c6fe952598053fa63631fc0161d666f22a50f51
{{!}} Functional link, equivalent to {{gitorious url|fg|flightgear|commit=5c6fe952598053fa63631fc0161d666f22a50f51}}.
{{!-}}
{{!}} {{tick}}
{{!}} [[Es/FlightGear Newsletter September 2010]]
{{!}} http://gitorious.org/fg/flightgear/commit/5c6fe952598053fa63631fc0161d666f22a50f51
{{!-}}
{{!}} {{tick}}
{{!}} [[FlightGear Newsletter January 2011]]
{{!}} http://gitorious.org/jsbsim/jsbsim
{{!}} Functional link.  Switched to {{gitorious url|jsbsim|jsbsim}} to future-protect the link.
{{!-}}
{{!}} {{tick}}
{{!}} [[Es/FlightGear Newsletter January 2011]]
{{!}} http://gitorious.org/jsbsim/jsbsim
{{!}} Functional link.  Switched to {{gitorious url|jsbsim|jsbsim}} to future-protect the link.
{{!-}}
{{!}} {{tick}}
{{!}} [[FlightGear Newsletter February 2011]]
{{!}} http://gitorious.org/headtrack
 
http://gitorious.org/arduinocockpit
{{!}} Project pages are dead, switched to {{gitorious url|headtrack|headtrack}}
 
{{gitorious url|arduinocockpit|arduinocockpit}}
{{!-}}
{{!}} {{tick}}
{{!}} [[Es/FlightGear Newsletter February 2011]]
{{!}} http://gitorious.org/arduinocockpi
 
http://gitorious.org/headtrack
{{!-}}
{{!}} {{tick}}
{{!}} [[FlightGear Newsletter March 2011]]
{{!}} http://gitorious.org/lockheed-l10-electra
{{!}} Missing project - i.e. {{gitlab source|user=emilianh|repo=Lockheed-L10-Electra|text=migrated to GitLab}}.  Switched to {{gitlab source|user=emilianh|repo=Lockheed-L10-Electra}}.
{{!-}}
{{!}} {{tick}}
{{!}} [[Es/FlightGear Newsletter March 2011]]
{{!}} http://gitorious.org/lockheed-l10-electra
{{!}} Switched to {{gitlab source|user=emilianh|repo=Lockheed-L10-Electra}}.
{{!-}}
{{!}} {{tick}}
{{!}} [[FlightGear Newsletter November 2011]]
{{!}} http://gitorious.org/flightgear-aircraft
{{!}} Switched to {{gitorious source}} and rephrased text slightly to help readers find the repositories.
{{!-}}
{{!}} {{tick}}
{{!}} [[FlightGear Newsletter October 2012]]
{{!}} http://gitorious.org/anders-hangar/mtb_20m/trees/master
{{!}} Switch to {{gitorious url|proj=anders-hangar|repo=mtb_20m}}
{{!-}}
{{!}} {{tick}}
{{!}} [[FlightGear Newsletter March 2013]]
{{!}} http://gitorious.org/fg/flightgear/blobs/next/scripts/java/FGClient/src/FGFSDemo.java
{{!}} Switched to {{gitorious url|proj=fg|repo=flightgear|path=scripts/java/FGClient/src/FGFSDemo.java}}.  This points to the old Gitorious repository to protect against path changes in the future.
{{!-}}
{{!}} {{tick}}
{{!}} [[FlightGear Newsletter September 2013]]
{{!}} http://gitorious.org/boeing/707
{{!}} Switched to {{gitorious source|proj=boeing|repo=707}}
{{!-}}
{{!}} {{tick}}
{{!}} [[Es/FlightGear Newsletter September 2013]]
{{!}} http://gitorious.org/boeing/707
{{!}} Switched to {{gitorious source|proj=boeing|repo=707}}
{{!-}}
{{!}} {{tick}}
{{!}} [[FlightGear Newsletter November 2013]]
{{!}} http://gitorious.org/fg/fgrun
{{!}} Switch to {{gitorious url|proj=fg|repo=fgrun}}
{{!-}}
{{!}} {{tick}}
{{!}} [[Es/FlightGear Newsletter November 2013]]
{{!}} http://gitorious.org/fg/fgrun
{{!}} Switch to {{gitorious url|proj=fg|repo=fgrun}}
{{!-}}
{{!}} {{tick}}
{{!}} [[FlightGear Newsletter July 2014]]
{{!}} http://gitorious.org/nasal-support/nasal-npp
{{!}} Switched to {{gitorious url|nasal-support|nasal-npp}}
{{!-}}
{{!}} {{tick}}
{{!}} [[FlightGear Newsletter April 2015]]
{{!}} http://gitorious.org
{{!}} Switched to {{tl|gitorious source}} without parameters for the Gitorious base URL, to future-protect it.
{{!}}}
 
https:...
{{{!}} class="wikitable"
! Fixed !! Newsletter !! Gitorious URL !! Notes
{{!-}}
{{!}} {{tick}}
{{!}} [[FlightGear Newsletter April 2011]]
{{!}} https://gitorious.org/papillon81/flightgear-custom-scenery/
 
https://gitorious.org/dvanmosselbeen/flightgear-custom-scenery
{{!}} Switched to {{gitorious source|dvanmosselbeen|flightgear-custom-scenery}} and {{gitorious source|papillon81|flightgear-custom-scenery}}
{{!-}}
{{!}} {{tick}}
{{!}} [[Es/FlightGear Newsletter April 2011]]
{{!}} https://gitorious.org/dvanmosselbeen/flightgear-custom-scenery
 
https://gitorious.org/papillon81/flightgear-custom-scenery/
{{!}} Switched to {{gitorious source|dvanmosselbeen|flightgear-custom-scenery}} and {{gitorious source|papillon81|flightgear-custom-scenery}}
{{!-}}
{{!}} {{tick}}
{{!}} [[FlightGear Newsletter July 2011]]
{{!}} https://gitorious.org/dvanmosselbeen/flightgear-custom-scenery
{{!}} Switched to {{gitorious source|dvanmosselbeen|flightgear-custom-scenery}}
{{!-}}
{{!}} {{tick}}
{{!}} [[Es/FlightGear Newsletter July 2011]]
{{!}} https://gitorious.org/dvanmosselbeen/flightgear-custom-scenery
{{!}} Switched to {{gitorious source|dvanmosselbeen|flightgear-custom-scenery}}
{{!-}}
{{!}} {{tick}}
{{!}} [[FlightGear Newsletter December 2011]]
{{!}} https://gitorious.org/dvanmosselbeen/flightgear-custom-scenery
{{!}} Switched to {{gitorious source|dvanmosselbeen|flightgear-custom-scenery}}
{{!-}}
{{!}} {{tick}}
{{!}} [[Fr/Nouvelles du projet FlightGear - décembre 2011]]
{{!}} https://gitorious.org/dvanmosselbeen/flightgear-custom-scenery
{{!}} Switched to {{gitorious source|dvanmosselbeen|flightgear-custom-scenery}}
{{!-}}
{{!}} {{tick}}
{{!}} [[FlightGear Newsletter April 2012]]
{{!}} https://gitorious.org/fg/fgdata/blobs/master/Aircraft/Instruments-3d/garmin196/README
 
https://gitorious.org/fg/fgdata/blobs/master/Aircraft/Instruments-3d/garmin196/doc/doc-en.htm
{{!}} Switched to {{fgdata source|path=Aircraft/Instruments-3d/garmin196/README|full=1}} and {{fgdata source|path=Aircraft/Instruments-3d/garmin196/doc/doc-en.htm|full=1}} to point to the current FGData locations and removed the name "Gitorious" to make the text of the Garmin 196 GPS section still relevant
{{!-}}
{{!}} {{tick}}
{{!}} [[FlightGear Newsletter August 2012]]
{{!}} https://gitorious.org/mil-mi-6
{{!}} Switched to {{gitorious url|proj=mil-mi-6|repo=mi6dev}}, and changed from the non-existent project page to the main repository.
{{!-}}
{{!}} {{tick}}
{{!}} [[FlightGear Newsletter October 2012]]
{{!}} https://gitorious.org/fgradar
{{!}} Switched from the project page to the direct repository {{gitorious url|fgradar|fgradar}}.
{{!-}}
{{!}} {{tick}}
{{!}} [[FlightGear Newsletter March 2013]]
{{!}} https://gitorious.org/fg/flightgear/commit/913727239d6776c0508d206f395e16c265413ec3
 
https://gitorious.org/fg/flightgear/commit/eba03b5e469824ee8f1494723fcddbbc56155a08
{{!}} Switched to {{flightgear url|commit=913727239d6776c0508d206f395e16c265413ec3}} and {{flightgear url|commit=eba03b5e469824ee8f1494723fcddbbc56155a08}}.  This deliberately points to the current repository.
{{!-}}
{{!}} {{tick}}
{{!}} [[FlightGear Newsletter April 2013]]
{{!}} https://gitorious.org/fg-radi/osm2city
 
https://gitorious.org/scenery-france-850
{{!}} Switched to the new GitLab repository {{gitlab source|proj=fg-radi|repo=osm2city|full=1}}
 
and removed the no longer existent scenery-france-850 repository, replacing it with "<s>Scenery repository (Gitorious)</s>".
{{!-}}
{{!}} {{tick}}
{{!}} [[FlightGear Newsletter October 2013]]
{{!}} https://gitorious.org/fg/galvedros-fgdata
{{!}} Switch to {{gitorious url|proj=fg|repo=galvedros-fgdata}}
{{!-}}
{{!}} {{tick}}
{{!}} [[Es/FlightGear Newsletter October 2013]]
{{!}} https://gitorious.org/fg/galvedros-fgdata
{{!}} Switch to {{gitorious url|proj=fg|repo=galvedros-fgdata}}
{{!-}}
{{!}} {{tick}}
{{!}} [[FlightGear Newsletter November 2013]]
{{!}} https://gitorious.org/ec130/
{{!}} Switched from the project page to the direct repository {{gitorious source|ec130|ec130}}.
{{!-}}
{{!}} {{tick}}
{{!}} [[Es/FlightGear Newsletter November 2013]]
{{!}} https://gitorious.org/ec130/
{{!}} Switched from the project page to the direct repository {{gitorious source|ec130|ec130}}.
{{!-}}
{{!}} {{tick}}
{{!}} [[FlightGear Newsletter February 2014]]
{{!}} https://gitorious.org/fg/philosophers-fgdata/source/022bef27f05d4837d720f63c6507b47466ff2a59:Nasal/console/repl.nas#L436
 
https://gitorious.org/fg/philosophers-fgdata/source/nasal-console:Nasal/console
 
https://gitorious.org/fg/fgdata/commit/eaaf816b772649d5b0826a1d0bdd166dbc5b968f
 
https://gitorious.org/fg/flightgear/commit/34ed79e5f88ffdfc5e651a1fe3e639cb8f4d3353
 
https://gitorious.org/fg/flightgear/commit/5eee5e42ae4f5cf56283b3bf5a3be46efc2b51c4
 
https://www.gitorious.org/fg/flightgear/merge_requests/26
{{!}} Switched to {{gitorious source|proj=fg|repo=philosophers-fgdata|branch=nasal-console|path=Nasal/console/repl.nas|line=708}}
 
{{gitorious url|proj=fg|repo=philosophers-fgdata|branch=nasal-console|path=Nasal/console|view=tree}}
 
{{fgdata-old url|commit=eaaf816b772649d5b0826a1d0bdd166dbc5b968f}}
 
{{flightgear commit|34ed79e5f88ffdfc5e651a1fe3e639cb8f4d3353}}
 
{{gitorious merge request|mr=54}}
 
{{gitorious merge request|mr=26}}
{{!-}}
{{!}} {{tick}}
{{!}} [[Es/FlightGear Newsletter February 2014]]
{{!}} https://gitorious.org/fg/philosophers-fgdata/source/022bef27f05d4837d720f63c6507b47466ff2a59:Nasal/console/repl.nas#L436
 
https://gitorious.org/fg/philosophers-fgdata/source/nasal-console:Nasal/console
 
https://gitorious.org/fg/fgdata/commit/eaaf816b772649d5b0826a1d0bdd166dbc5b968f
 
https://gitorious.org/fg/flightgear/commit/34ed79e5f88ffdfc5e651a1fe3e639cb8f4d3353
 
https://gitorious.org/fg/flightgear/commit/5eee5e42ae4f5cf56283b3bf5a3be46efc2b51c4
 
https://www.gitorious.org/fg/flightgear/merge_requests/26
{{!}} Changes match the English article.
{{!-}}
{{!}} {{tick}}
{{!}} [[FlightGear Newsletter April 2014]]
{{!}} https://gitorious.org/fg/fgdata/flightgear?p=fg/fgdata:flightgear.git;a=blob;f=keyboard.xml
 
https://gitorious.org/fg/fgdata?p=fg:fgdata.git;a=commit;h=f8c56dcc52ffd3d6dfca1d39dc4a72b6b3478368
 
https://gitorious.org/fg/hoorays-flightgear?p=fg:hoorays-flightgear.git;a=shortlog;h=refs/heads/topics/cppbind-fgprotocol
{{!}} This first link was the broken {{tl|git link}} template (see the table below).  The other two links are not in the article?!
{{!-}}
{{!}} {{tick}}
{{!}} [[FlightGear Newsletter June 2014]]
{{!}} https://gitorious.org/eddp-custom-scenery/eddp-custom-scenery/
{{!}} Switched to {{tl|gitorious clone}} to provide functional '''git clone''' instructions.
{{!-}}
{{!}} {{tick}}
{{!}} [[FlightGear Newsletter November 2014]]
{{!}} https://gitorious.org/fg/hoorays-fgdata/source/2857d8fc9fcfe2bb162a9eb9d3dcca4d41b3a876:Nasal/ai/aim9/aim9.fdm#L9
{{!}} Switch to {{gitorious url|proj=fg|repo=hoorays-fgdata|commit=2857d8fc9fcfe2bb162a9eb9d3dcca4d41b3a876|path=Nasal/ai/aim9/aim9.fdm|line=9}}
{{!-}}
{{!}} {{tick}}
{{!}} [[FlightGear Newsletter January 2015]]
{{!}} https://gitorious.org/fg/canvas-hackers-fgdata/source/f59c42134a5a77e343981dcff8278c3e2f094e87
{{!}} Switch to {{gitorious url|proj=fg|repo=canvas-hackers-fgdata|commit=f59c42134a5a77e343981dcff8278c3e2f094e87|view=summary}}
{{!}}}
 
Broken templates:...
{{{!}} class="wikitable"
! Fixed !! Newsletter !! Template !! Notes
{{!-}}
{{!}} {{tick}}
{{!}} [[FlightGear Newsletter April 2014]]
{{!}} {{tlx|Git link|gitorious|fg/fgdata|master|keyboard.xml|pre=$FG_ROOT/}}
{{!}} Switched to {{fgdata source|path=keyboard.xml|pre=$FG_ROOT}} to fix the Gitorious link created by the broken and depreciated {{tl|git link}} template.
{{!}}}
 
}}
 
::: —[[User:Johan G|Johan G]] ([[User_talk:Johan_G|Talk]] | [[Special:Contributions/Johan_G|contribs]]) 12:06, 9 March 2016 (EST)
 
:::: I've added a '''notes''' column to help a little.
 
:::: [[User:Bugman|Bugman]] ([[User talk:Bugman|talk]]) 12:30, 9 March 2016 (EST)
 
=== Elimination of the dead Gitorious links ===
Thanks largely to the diversity and flexibility of the [[:Category:Repository link templates|{{obr}}repo link{{cbr}} family of templates]], I have now managed to eliminate almost every last dead Gitorious link in the FlightGear wiki!  The locked Newsletter articles, user pages, and talk pages are the only exceptions.  The page counts from the (Main) namespace are:
* [http://wiki.flightgear.org/index.php?target=http%3A%2F%2Fgitorious.org&namespace=0&title=Special%3ALinkSearch <nowiki>Special:LinkSearch for http://gitorious.org</nowiki>] &mdash; 37.  Of these, 17 are for the front page with the news of the Gitorious to SourceForge migration, and the rest are Newsletters.
* [http://wiki.flightgear.org/index.php?title=Special:LinkSearch&limit=500&offset=0&target=https%3A%2F%2Fgitorious.org&namespace=0 <nowiki>Special:LinkSearch for https://gitorious.org</nowiki>] &mdash; 166.  Most of these links are valid and created by the {{obr}}gitorious *{{cbr}} subtemplates of {{tl|repo link}}.  The remaining broken links are all in the locked Newsletters.
The Howto:* pages are not in the (Main) wiki namespace, but I've knocked those out too.
 
[[User:Bugman|Bugman]] ([[User talk:Bugman|talk]]) 13:54, 10 March 2016 (EST)
 
: thanks for doing all this unglamorous work - I am sorry that Gijs was apparently too busy to follow up on my suggestion to either provide you with admin access around here, or at least to help you run a Python script to do all this work in an automated, rather than manual, fashion. Hopefully, things will work out better next time. Again, thank you. Like I said, I think you should definitely be given admin access on the wiki, especially given your recent contributions - and I would gladly have my wiki status downgraded accordingly. In fact, if I was able to directly promote accounts accordingly, I would have done so months ago - however, it seems that Gijs is the only one to have those privileges, and he mentioned off-list that he's kinda busy with RL/exams etc, so it is to be expected that he's going to become a bottleneck more often - hopefully, this will be recongized as an actual issue, so that there will be more people able to promote new wiki admins. Sorry that things didn't work out better this time, and thanks so much for doing all this stuff manually. -[[User:Hooray|Hooray]] ([[User talk:Hooray|talk]]) 14:49, 10 March 2016 (EST)
 
:: No problems!  As for automating this, that would not have been possible.  If you look at the changes, you'll see that each one is different <sup>[http://wiki.flightgear.org/index.php?title=Special:RecentChanges&to=20160310210655&limit=500]</sup>.  I had to check each one, and update the link as required.
 
:: [[User:Bugman|Bugman]] ([[User talk:Bugman|talk]]) 16:08, 10 March 2016 (EST)
 
::: There's three of us actually (Curt, Simon and myself), no need to wait on me. See http://wiki.flightgear.org/index.php?title=Special%3AListUsers&username=&group=bureaucrat&limit=100 (Sek is inactive nowadays) ;-)
::: Please note that forum pms are really not the best way to contact me. I very much prefer email over forum pms as it's a lot easier to filter out the huge amounts of nonsense I'm receiving from stuff requiring actual attention.
::: Anyhow I've just  promoted Bugman so he can edit locked articles.
::: [[User:Gijs|Gijs]] ([[User talk:Gijs|talk]]) 05:06, 11 March 2016 (EST)
 
:::: Thank you.  I'll try to preserve the original intent of the Newsletters while fixing the broken links (maybe even preserving any original URLs as Mediawiki link text, while pointing to the new URL).  I will use the {{obr}}gitorious *{{cbr}} templates to point to the historical sources, and will probably use this for all of the Gitorious URLs so that we have full control over any future URL breakages via the single location of {{tl|repo link}}.  For example, if they change the gitorious.org domain name to a https://archive.org subdomain (i.e. gitorious.archive.org).
 
:::: [[User:Bugman|Bugman]] ([[User talk:Bugman|talk]]) 06:40, 11 March 2016 (EST)
 
=== Regex parsing of template parameters? ===
 
For the {{tl|repo link}} template, I am currently trying to work out what to do for git branches and tags on the SourceForge infrastructure.  The problem is that the presence of the character <code>/</code> within a branch or tag name requires the text <code>/~</code> to be appended to that name in the URL, for example:
 
* Tag <code>version/2016.1.1</code>:  https://sourceforge.net/p/flightgear/simgear/ci/version/2016.1.1/~/tree/simgear/ephemeris/ephemeris.cxx
* Branch <code>release/2016.1</code>:  https://sourceforge.net/p/flightgear/simgear/ci/release/2016.1/~/tree/simgear/ephemeris/ephemeris.cxx
 
I haven't found out a way to use regex to parse the <code>tag</code> or <code>branch</code> template parameters to automate this, hence I am thinking of just giving the instruction for the template user to append this text to the <code>tag</code> or <code>branch</code> parameter text themselves.  However this is not ideal - a change of this behaviour on the SourceForge side requires end pages with SourceForge URLs to be updated, rather than just updating {{tl|repo link}}.  I was wondering about possibility of installing the extension:
 
* [https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Extension:RegexParserFunctions Extension:RegexParserFunctions]
 
Though I'm not 100% sure if that will work.  Or does someone else know an alternative?  Cheers!
 
[[User:Bugman|Bugman]] ([[User talk:Bugman|talk]]) 12:09, 22 April 2016 (EDT)
 
: not a solution, just a potential workaround would be checking for the most common prefix strings used in tags/branches (e.g. version, release, topic, topics) and explicitly rewrite the URL accordingly to append the /~ suffix -[[User:Hooray|Hooray]] ([[User talk:Hooray|talk]]) 12:59, 22 April 2016 (EDT)
 
:: That might be a solution.  But I don't know how to do that without regex ;)  We really only have #ifeq statements, but that has to match the whole string.
 
:: [[User:Bugman|Bugman]] ([[User talk:Bugman|talk]]) 13:44, 22 April 2016 (EDT)
 
As a temporary workaround, I'll update the SourceForge {{tl|repo link}} template instructions to tell the user to append <code>/~</code> to the branch or tag name, if the <code>/</code> character is present.
 
[[User:Bugman|Bugman]] ([[User talk:Bugman|talk]]) 10:31, 20 May 2016 (EDT)
 
== Discussion about quotes on the wiki ==
{{usr|Hooray}} have started a page now at [[FlightGear wiki:Quoting Guidelines]] ([http://wiki.flightgear.org/index.php?title=FlightGear_wiki:Quoting_Guidelines&oldid=96104 perm]) for a discussion regarding guidelines for the use of quotes on the wiki.  Join the discussion.
 
—[[User:Johan G|Johan G]] ([[User_talk:Johan_G|Talk]] | [[Special:Contributions/Johan_G|contribs]]) 18:17, 21 March 2016 (EDT)
 
 
In slight relation to this I have tried to make the wiki more consistently use the most common spelling and case, "Instant-Cquotes" and have changed the automatic categorization accordingly.  All articles using the {{tl|FGCquote}} template can now be found in [[:Category:Articles containing Instant-Cquotes]] (currently some ~250 articles).
 
—[[User:Johan G|Johan G]] ([[User_talk:Johan_G|Talk]] | [[Special:Contributions/Johan_G|contribs]]) 08:21, 23 March 2016 (EDT)
 
== Reorganizing the Git articles ==
I've noticed that the [[:Category:Git|Git articles]] suffer from duplication and are in part obsolete (especially with regard to the instructions for running Git on Windows). Thus, I propose the following reorganization:
* [[Development workflow]]: reorganization to explain how the patch submission process is organized from a high-level point of view (forking the repository from SourceForge, developing, pushing the commits to the personal fork, submitting a merge request/sending a patch to the mailing list);
* [[FlightGear Git]]: leave as is;
* '''Installing and configuring Git''' - new article about installing Git and configuring it (setting the username/e-mail address); merge the contents of [[FlightGear Git on Windows]] and [[Resources WRT running git on Win32]] here;
* [[FlightGear Git for laymen]] - make it follow [[FGW:MOS]], merge the contents of [[Howto:Start using git]] here;
* [[FlightGear Git: core developers]] and [[FlightGear Git: data developers]] - I'm uncertain about what I should do with them: the only piece information that would not be written in other articles is the list of alternative methods for cloning FGData;
* [[FlightGear Git: gitiquette]] and [[FlightGear Git: tips]] - make them follow [[FGW:MOS]].
Any comments? -- [[User:Elgaton|ElGaton]] ([[User talk:Elgaton|<tt>talk</tt> to me]]) 06:11, 13 May 2016 (EDT)
 
: This is sorely needed!  For [[FlightGear Git: core developers]] and [[FlightGear Git: data developers]], maybe these can be merged into something like [[FlightGear Git: working with the repositories]]?  The only real difference is the URL, but that is a minor difference with the [[:Category:Repository link templates]].  This could be generalised into a set of instructions for working with all git repositories for the core infrastructure, including forking and merge requests, with a current focus on the SourceForge web and non-web interfaces.
 
: [[User:Bugman|Bugman]] ([[User talk:Bugman|talk]]) 08:17, 13 May 2016 (EDT)
 
:: Yes, I was thinking about a similar solution as well. -- [[User:Elgaton|ElGaton]] ([[User talk:Elgaton|<tt>talk</tt> to me]]) 10:16, 13 May 2016 (EDT)
 
: For the reorganisation of the articles, it would be good to make a lot of use of the {{tl|Project infrastructure}} template.  This will abstract away the SourceForge infrastructure (well some instructions will be 100% SourceForge specific, so it won't be perfect).  I would like to however have [[Template talk:Project infrastructure#Slight variation of the current architecture|Johan's design]] implemented first, as it would be quite beneficial.
 
: [[User:Bugman|Bugman]] ([[User talk:Bugman|talk]]) 18:43, 14 May 2016 (EDT)
:: Thanks, didn't know it existed. Right now I'm fixing some last-minute bugs before the release, but I'll have a look at this. -- [[User:Elgaton|ElGaton]] ([[User talk:Elgaton|<tt>talk</tt> to me]]) 09:05, 15 May 2016 (EDT)
 
::: And while we're at it, we also have a handful of git related templates to abstract away UI-specifics, which would allow us/me to upload screenshots for different interfaces (CLI, tortoisegit etc), so that we only need to update the templates, and not touch any  of those articles. OTOH, I cannot seem to find a recent discussion of the idea, only http://wiki.flightgear.org/Talk:Development_workflow and that has not been updated in 3 years. Any opinions ? -[[User:Hooray|Hooray]] ([[User talk:Hooray|talk]]) 20:52, 15 May 2016 (EDT)
:::: I'm not fully sold on this one. I see the point of creating templates (for example, the Git commands mentioned in [[Talk:Development workflow]] can be used in aircraft pages to explain how to checkout a development version from a private repository), but, in my opinion, screenshots are a bit "heavy" to be reused in other articles (beside the Git ones). Did you plan to use them in other pages and, if yes, how? -- [[User:Elgaton|ElGaton]] ([[User talk:Elgaton|<tt>talk</tt> to me]]) 14:11, 23 May 2016 (EDT)
 
:: It was originally intended to document different UIs and workflows - i.e. by parameterizing the templates, so that a matching set of commands, and screenshots, could be shown. The basic idea was that we have a growing number of articles detailing git workflows (clone, checkout, push, branch etc) - and it seemed to make sense to have a single article/template documenting the specifics, so that other articles could merely use that template, while specifiying the "action" and any other variable items (repository, branch etc) - and then use a template to provide the matching command line. However, don't worry - we don't need to do it that way. Originally, it was all inspired by [[Howto:Build FlightGear with NetBeans using CMake]]. -[[User:Hooray|Hooray]] ([[User talk:Hooray|talk]]) 14:23, 23 May 2016 (EDT)
 
== UTF-8 language pages cannot be edited ==
 
This is a continuation of [[FlightGear wiki:Village pump/Archive 2015#UTF-8 language pages cannot be edited]].  I can see that wiki editors are [[Zh/FlightGear Wiki|forced to create workarounds]], as the [[Main page]] in Chinese [http://wiki.flightgear.org/index.php?title=Zh/%E9%A6%96%E9%A1%B5&action=edit cannot be edited].  I think it is quite important to solve this ''"A database query error has occurred. This may indicate a bug in the software"'' issue.  As the fix is quite dangerous (see {{mediawiki|Topic:S1q54kosfdkhz6w1}}), do we have a backup system?  Do we have regular mysql and ftp dumps that can be backed up locally using rsync?
 
[[User:Bugman|Bugman]] ([[User talk:Bugman|talk]]) 05:16, 15 May 2016 (EDT)
 
: This is quite urgent!  We have a new contributor who would like to add Greek translations to our wiki, but he is completely blocked.  Here are the steps to reproduce:
:* Go the the main page.
:* Click on the "Ελληνικά" language (Greek in Greek).
:* As the page doesn't exist, create it.
:* See the error message "A database query error has occurred. This may indicate a bug in the software".
 
: [[User:Bugman|Bugman]] ([[User talk:Bugman|talk]]) 17:30, 19 June 2016 (EDT)
 
=== Non-latin characters in the URL ===
 
The problem is non-latin characters in the URL.  I just ran a test:
 
* Edit [[Zh/你好]] → ''"A database query error has occurred. This may indicate a bug in the software"''
* Edit the latin equivalent [[Zh/nihao]] → No error.
 
Let me repeat that fixing this huge bug should be given the highest priority, as it prevents the wiki from being translated into many, many languages.
 
[[User:Bugman|Bugman]] ([[User talk:Bugman|talk]]) 05:30, 28 June 2016 (EDT)
 
== Making wiki specific templates available via editor ? ==
We now have an increasing number of wiki specific templates that should be more widely used, so that it would make sense to integrate those with the default mediawiki editor - e.g. the URL encapsulating templates. -[[User:Hooray|Hooray]] ([[User talk:Hooray|talk]]) 10:12, 16 May 2016 (EDT)
 
== Categorizing aircraft infoboxes by hangar ==
I would like to bring the discussions from [[Template talk:Infobox aircraft#fgaddon aircraft]] into here for greater exposure.  The idea discussed there was to add <code>hangar</code> and <code>aircraft</code> parameters to automate and categorise the aircraft infoboxes.  This is to help readers instantly identify the source of the aircraft and to give greater exposure to 3rd party hangars or independent aircraft.  To show off the potential of this automated approach, I have created an example template at [[User:Bugman/Infobox Aircraft]] (see the bottom for an example based on the [[Space Shuttle]] infobox).  Each [[FlightGear hangars#Third party sites|3rd party hangar]] can add one of the following options:
 
* The hangar logo, with a link to the hangar.  For example I have created an initial test logo for FGAddon:  [[File:FGAddon logo.png|80px]]
* Development repository link.  An automatically created link, if the {{param|development}} parameter is not supplied.
* Download link.  An automatically created link, if the {{param|download}} parameter is not supplied.
* A hangar category.  For example [[:Category:FGAddon hangar]].
 
Feedback would be appreciated.  Cheers!
 
[[User:Bugman|Bugman]] ([[User talk:Bugman|talk]]) 04:53, 25 May 2016 (EDT)
 
: Following from these ideas, I have made a proposal for a new template:  [[Template talk:Infobox aircraft#Proposal for a new aircraft infobox template design (2016/06)]].  The more feedback on this, the better ;)  Cheers!
 
: [[User:Bugman|Bugman]] ([[User talk:Bugman|talk]]) 10:17, 1 June 2016 (EDT)
 
:: Thanks for your work - looks good, the only change I would make is (as you noted in the template talk page) replacing the repository/download/livery database/forum thread icons with something more suitable and less "brilliant" icons (though I admit I don't have an alternative proposal for this right now). -- [[User:Elgaton|ElGaton]] ([[User talk:Elgaton|<tt>talk</tt> to me]]) 04:40, 2 June 2016 (EDT)
 
::: Cheers!  I used the high quality Oxygen icon set from the git repository at https://quickgit.kde.org/?p=oxygen-icons.git (this used to be at svn://anonsvn.kde.org/home/kde/trunk/kdesupport/oxygen-icons), as these are {{tl|LGPLv3}} licensed, and hence usable on this wiki.  I especially liked the gender neutral icon for the forum:  [[File:Meeting-attending 32x32.png]].  They are hi-colour and hence match the bright yellow status stars, but they don't match the minimalistic {{tl|ready}} icons.  Anyway, we can switch to a different icon set after the template and aircraft infobox collection have been updated, and once a suitable set is found or created and, more importantly, once a FG wiki-wide colour scheme policy has been discussed ;)
 
::: — [[User:Bugman|Bugman]] ([[User talk:Bugman|talk]]) 05:21, 2 June 2016 (EDT)
 
=== Bermuda Triangle ===
 
To allow for the easy management of wiki articles in which the aircraft appears to have been lost, I have created the new [[:Category:Bermuda Triangle]] aircraft "hangar".  If the {{param|hangar}} parameter for the {{tl|infobox aircraft}} is set to {{param||bermuda}}, then the result is:  [[Template:Infobox aircraft#Lost aircraft]].  Feedback is more than welcome!
 
[[User:Bugman|Bugman]] ([[User talk:Bugman|talk]]) 06:36, 2 August 2016 (EDT)
 
== Set up a robot to fix all the broken "prettytable" table classes? ==
 
After the last Mediawiki update, the "prettytable" class for tables is no longer defined.  I believe that it has been merged into the "wikitable" class.  Here is a before and after example of fixing the tables:
* http://wiki.flightgear.org/index.php?title=List_of_abbreviations&oldid=70465
* http://wiki.flightgear.org/index.php?title=List_of_abbreviations&oldid=99718
I suggest automating the conversion of "prettytable" to "wikitable", as this is an absolutely huge job.
 
[[User:Bugman|Bugman]] ([[User talk:Bugman|talk]]) 14:04, 10 June 2016 (EDT)


: For reference, here is what the "prettytable" class formatting was like prior to its disappearance:
'''NOTE:''' i've copied this from my talk page to bring everything together here in one place as suggested on the forum by bugman...
:* https://web.archive.org/web/20150510160626/http://wiki.flightgear.org/List_of_abbreviations
: The tables without borders that we now see is not the original format desired by those creating the tables (prior to sometime in 2015).


: [[User:Bugman|Bugman]] ([[User talk:Bugman|talk]]) 11:05, 13 June 2016 (EDT)
: This is easy, see http://wiki.flightgear.org/Special:Import ;)


:: As a workaround, I have redefined the "prettytable" class in [[Mediawiki:common.css]].
: [[User:Bugman|Bugman]] ([[User talk:Bugman|talk]]) 18:15, 5 September 2017 (EDT)


:: [[User:Bugman|Bugman]] ([[User talk:Bugman|talk]]) 06:23, 22 July 2016 (EDT)
: And here is the Wikipedia export page: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special:Export.  You just export from one and import from the other.  Quite a few templates were created in this way.


=== A new "keytable" class ===
: [[User:Bugman|Bugman]] ([[User talk:Bugman|talk]]) 06:21, 6 September 2017 (EDT)


For an improved table formatting which sits well with the {{tl|key press}} template, I have defined the new "keytable" class in [[Mediawiki:common.css]].  This is for the elegant formatting of keyboard shortcut tables.  It uses high quality typesetting rules: There is no background colour; uses generous margins and padding; only horizontal dividers at the top and bottom and between the header and main content; somewhat indented from the main text.  Here is an example (which will change as the "keytable" styles are refined):
:: <strike>is this something i should do? i don't want to mess anything up ;) </strike>
:: NVM... i'm not an admin so i cannot import :)
:: [[User:Wkitty42|Wkitty42]] ([[User talk:Wkitty42|talk]]) 10:58, 6 September 2017 (EDT)


{| class="keytable"
::: Looking at the template source at Wikipedia and on from there, I see that it have a not so small dependency tree, starting with a [https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Module:Convert&action=edit nearly 4000 line lua module] :-/
! Key
! Function
|-
| {{key press|d}}
| Open/close crew door
|-
| {{key press|D}}
| Open/close passenger door
|}


[[User:Bugman|Bugman]] ([[User talk:Bugman|talk]]) 07:49, 21 July 2016 (EDT)
::: Something rather simpler can probably be built with what we already have (though it will take time).


== URL change notifications ==
::: What do we ''really'' need?
Referring to controversial URL changes like <ref>http://wiki.flightgear.org/index.php?title=Airbus_A340-600HGW&diff=99775&oldid=99774</ref>, could we discuss setting up some rules, infrastructure/tools to get a notification when certain links (regex) are updated/added ? For now, I have updated http://wiki.flightgear.org/MediaWiki:Spam-blacklist accordingly.-[[User:Hooray|Hooray]] ([[User talk:Hooray|talk]]) 06:23, 12 June 2016 (EDT)


: We currently have these situations under control<ref>http://wiki.flightgear.org/index.php?title=Airbus_A340-600HGW&diff=next&oldid=99776</ref>, and I have been able to resolve them in a way that is beneficial to all.  So I don't think we need such measures.  Education is more productive, as the intent is good.  And I believe that both monitoring the recent changes list and a simple search for that keyword are sufficient for now.
::: —[[User:Johan G|Johan G]] ([[User_talk:Johan_G|Talk]] | [[Special:Contributions/Johan_G|contribs]]) 11:01, 29 October 2017 (EDT)


: [[User:Bugman|Bugman]] ([[User talk:Bugman|talk]]) 11:11, 13 June 2016 (EDT)
:::: whoa! i didn't know that convert template was that involved... maybe it does a whole lot more conversions than i was looking at to use on this site...


== SVG graphics support? ==
:::: as far as "need" goes, we don't really need it but i thought it would be nice to put standard numerics and have a template to list the different conversions... other than needing to be added to pages where it would be appropriate, it would standardize their display on the page...
I was wondering if we could [https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Manual:Image_administration#SVG enable SVG graphics support]?  Currently we cannot upload svg files<ref>https://forum.flightgear.org/viewtopic.php?t=29732&p=288612#p288612</ref>.  The purpose would be for high quality graphics at all resolutions for icons, logos, banners, etc., and allowing for low resolution bitmap graphics to be made into higher resolution graphics for future wiki purposes.


[[User:Bugman|Bugman]] ([[User talk:Bugman|talk]]) 10:49, 13 June 2016 (EDT)
:::: [[User:Wkitty42|Wkitty42]] ([[User talk:Wkitty42|talk]]) 11:38, 29 October 2017 (EDT)


== Thai language support ==
::::: Maybe I should rephrase myself, as I did not intend to kill the conversation.


Could we please have Thai (th) added to the supported langauges in LocalSettings.php? Cheers!
::::: What do we need?  Something like {{obr}}'''convert'''|value|from-unit|to-unit|''decimals''|''hide-unit''{{cbr}} used like {{obr}}convert|15|m/s|fps{{cbr}} to get "49 fps"?


[[User:Bugman|Bugman]] ([[User talk:Bugman|talk]]) 07:21, 10 August 2016 (EDT)
::::: I think it is very much possible to do with what we have.  It basically abstracts to a matrix of statements from the two unit switches and math done with Mediawiki's [https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Help:Extension:ParserFunctions##expr #expr parser function] ([https://www.mediawiki.org/w/index.php?title=Help:Extension:ParserFunctions&oldid=2559944##expr perm]).


== new portal for cockpit building (hardware) ? ==
::::: ICAO Annex 4 could give some pointers for units, abbreviations and conversion factors.
We are now seeing an increasing number of articles relating to hardware/cockpit building -- [[User:Hooray|Hooray]] ([[User talk:Hooray|talk]]) 13:57, 21 August 2016 (EDT)


* [[Howto:C172P Panel Project]]
::::: Sounding a bit like Horay here, but I think converting between the the most used units could most probably be done ''well'' within a couple hundred lines of (well formatted and commented) template code (including user documentation).
* [[Howto:Build your own procedure trainer]]
* [[Howto:Build your own Panel or Cockpit]]
* [[Howto:Build your own Panel or Cockpit - Prototyping]]
* [[Howto:Build your own Panel or Cockpit - Software]]


::::: —[[User:Johan G|Johan G]] ([[User_talk:Johan_G|Talk]] | [[Special:Contributions/Johan_G|contribs]]) 05:04, 11 November 2017 (EST)


See also [[:Category:Cockpit_building]]
::::: An early convert template draft is now available in my sandbox.
::::: —[[User:Johan G|Johan G]] ([[User_talk:Johan_G|Talk]] | [[Special:Contributions/Johan_G|contribs]]) 09:17, 11 November 2017 (EST)

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Welcome to the Village Pump. This page is used to discuss the technical issues, operations and guidelines of the FlightGear wiki.

Please add new topics to the bottom of this page.

Old discussion should be moved to a FlightGear wiki:Village pump/Archive YEAR. These discussions can then be moved to a relevant talk page if appropriate.

2018

Captcha

Hi all! I need to fill the captcha box for each edit or new page in this wiki. I think for registered users isn't necessary. I will be glad if its removed. Thanks

2017

Build Templates

I only just realized that we're unnecessarily duplicating information in most build related articles by separately mentioning build dependecies instead of using a shared template, which would also be easier to update/maintain should the build requirements change (think osg 3.4), which would also mean that it would be easier to maintain correct URLs for each depenedncy, while also having a way to nicely keep dependencies for different fgfs versions - so probably a worthwile thing to do... -Hooray (talk) 07:17, 31 December 2017 (EST)

New Portals (Dec/2017)

Looking at the forum/devel list, two more portals may make sense:

  • RC
  • Cockpit Building

Thoughts / ideas ?

-Hooray (talk) 10:22, 29 December 2017 (EST)

Newsletter templates (June/2017)

Referring to Johan's comments at [1]: Is there anything we can do to unify newsletters and changelogs without requiring major additions to the wiki in the form of plugins/addons ? Specifically, I was wondering if something along these lines would be worthwhile to discuss:

  • Create a basic template-based structure to add standardized announcements/news
  • These would be standardized based on category (core, aircraft, scenery, canvas, Nasal etc), inspired by recent changelogs/newsletters
  • Move specific text to sub-templates, so that we can easily localize/translate those using a handful of templates
  • support optional screenshots/youtube links
  • support optional fields to be added/excluded in a given mode (newsletter vs. changelog)

In other words, we would review our published newsletters and changelogs and determine the common structure that could be re-implemented in the form of templates, and then come up with a handful of templates to add items in a standardized fashion, e.g. along these lines:

  • category
  • new/updated/removed feature
  • headline
  • common text
  • changelog specific text
  • newsletter specific text
  • screenshots
  • videos
  • link for additional information

Something like this could be easily implemented without much wiki magic, and it could be also easily translated at the template level

Thoughts / ideas ?

-Hooray (talk) 06:40, 2 July 2017 (EDT)

I will start slightly off topic with that I actually consider the current newsletter format to be slightly more complicated than it really needs to be. This is mostly due to the handcrafted table of contents replacing the automatically added one. If we go back a few years a wiki newsletter page was done exactly as any other wiki page using the same way to add headers and with an automatically generated table of contents.
To illustrate the above, compare the 2010 newsletter (plain article style, one template for the header), the intermediate 2011 newsletter (one additional template to move the ToC right and change the text flow) and the later 2015 newsletter (discarding the automatic ToC for a handcrafted one using a template for each main section and subsections added by hand.) Even if that is only so much resistance, it can be what stops a contributor.
What I was referring to with
Cquote1.png I think it would be technically possible to make templates that could simplify adding new newsletter blanks (but I have said that for years without doing anything about it :oops: ).
Cquote2.png
was that one can make templates that will import a page blank prepared with regular sections and subsections (that technique have been used on English Wikipedia for adding template documentation.)
In essence such a newsletter blank could have some of this prepared and some commented out suggestions for how to add a new section and how to add images and embedded videos etc.
Johan G (Talk | contribs) 09:14, 3 September 2017 (EDT)
I found my way back to some documentation on what I mentioned above.[2][3]
One would basically make a subpage to the template (say {{Newsletter-new}}) with the text to be preloaded (which is the term used) on the subpage (Template:Newsletter-new/Newsletter_blank) and link to it like this http://wiki.flightgear.org/index.php?title=FlightGear_Newsletter_<month>_<year>&action=edit&preload=Template:Newsletter-new/Newsletter_blank.
The new newsletter template could simply have a link "Click here to create the next newsletter". It needs to be on another page than the newsletter itself though, for example on a page describing how to contribute to the newsletter.
Johan G (Talk | contribs) 09:43, 3 September 2017 (EDT)
I totally agree, while I appreciate the appearance of the new newsletter template, I always found it cumbersome/tedious to actually edit the newsletter compared to the old way. And I am all for automation. Then again, we have been suggesting/requesting certain plugins to be installed, but unfortunately to no avail so far. Speaking in general, it would be great if we could identify some of the recurring tasks on the wiki and find a way to automate most of these. For instance, being able to add contents to one page that shows up on other pages would also be useful, as this could greatly simplify writing the changelog - imagine adding stuff to the newsletter, which is then automagically added to the proper changelog. However, as usual it seems manpower is our primary constraint, Curt does not seem to have the corresponding privileges here and Gijs is basically n/a these days. What is really needed is an additional wiki admin, someone with Simon's privileges. And I would suggest we nominate bugman for that position :-) - Hooray (talk)
Yikes, this actually works: http://wiki.flightgear.org/index.php?title=FlightGear_Newsletter_November_2020&action=edit&preload=Talk:Next_newsletter -Hooray (talk)
An early newsletter template draft is now available in my sandbox.
Johan G (Talk | contribs) 07:09, 11 November 2017 (EST)
I got around to polish it a bit more now: User:Johan G/Template:This months newsletter
Johan G (Talk | contribs) 12:32, 19 November 2017 (EST)
hi! If you Johan that you're more experienced can prepare Newsletter templates and pages to facilitate translations without need to create descentralised templates and duplicated pages, it would be nice and step forward to non English-speaker users. What you think about be able to do it for December Newsletter? Thank you so much for your work for templates, pages and the wiki!--Catalanoic (talk) 13:15, 10 December 2017 (EST)
Sorry for the late reply.
Yes, a centralized newsletter can be done rather easily. We could add {{LangSwitch}} templates to the sections in the newsletter template (hopefully users adding other sections to a particular newsletter will see what is going on and copy it). It should then be a matter of creating an empty page with a language prefix and transclude the newsletter there as if it was a template.
The downsides are that the newsletter will be more complicated to edit (raising the threshold for new editors and stopping a few of them), that we most likely will not be able to edit just a section (as the section headings will need to be in the language templates as the need to be translated as well), and that the page will be larger to retrieve as you will always download all languages to view or edit the page. I do not think it will be worth it.
However, if we get to the point that we have a template preloading a newsletter blank as discussed earlier in this topic (which seems very likely), we should probably have one for each of the languages someone can translate it to. I think it would be much, much better to centralize this template.
In short: With the approach above the newsletter can be made so that there is a centralized version. But I do not think it is worth the large downsides and think that would be better to instead have a centralized template preloading a newsletter blank for a specific language.
Johan G (Talk | contribs) 23:48, 21 July 2018 (EDT)
Hi, currently the German newsletter gets translated like every normal article here on a new page. Works great. I don't think the newsletter would benefit from a centralised Newsletter using {{LangSwitch}} as
  • you also need to create a [[Es/FG News Marzo 2019]] page every month to view the translated content on it
  • it invites to write a new article in your language and we need to find someone to translate it back to english
  • wiki code already is a challenge for new authors, LangSwitch would make it even worse!
My sandbox experiments take another approach:
All these templates should work. Like {{:User:Skybike/Template:This months newsletter|date=2018-11}} Create FlightGear Newsletter November 2018 and by adding lang=de: Den FlightGear Newsletter November 2018 erstellen.
Legoboyvdlp already created FlightGear Newsletter September 2018‎ with it.(Surprised me, need to change the header template there as it links to my sandbox) Note the "create next edition" in the upper right of the header there. But temporarily a new language could use my sandbox as well, just create a new newsletter blank and translate This months newsletter and Newsletter-header-translate.
Skybike (talk) 10:10, 22 July 2018 (EDT)

Using Template:Convert

while looking at the Lockheed_Martin_F-35B_Lightning_II, I noted the use of units that we could automatically have converted for us using the convert template from wikipedia... i'm assuming that we can do that, right? so below is an example of how it would be used and how it would look... i've left the original entry in place for final result comparison...

=== Performance Data ===
* '''Maximum Speed:''' 1,200 mph {{convert|1200|mph|kt|abbr=on}}
* '''Rate of climb:''' classified
* '''Service Ceiling:''' 60,000 ft {{convert|60000|ft|m|abbr=on}}
* '''Range:''' 1,200 mi {{convert|1200|mi|km|abbr=on}}
=== Performance Data ===

NOTE: i've copied this from my talk page to bring everything together here in one place as suggested on the forum by bugman...

This is easy, see http://wiki.flightgear.org/Special:Import ;)
Bugman (talk) 18:15, 5 September 2017 (EDT)
And here is the Wikipedia export page: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special:Export. You just export from one and import from the other. Quite a few templates were created in this way.
Bugman (talk) 06:21, 6 September 2017 (EDT)
is this something i should do? i don't want to mess anything up ;)
NVM... i'm not an admin so i cannot import :)
Wkitty42 (talk) 10:58, 6 September 2017 (EDT)
Looking at the template source at Wikipedia and on from there, I see that it have a not so small dependency tree, starting with a nearly 4000 line lua module :-/
Something rather simpler can probably be built with what we already have (though it will take time).
What do we really need?
Johan G (Talk | contribs) 11:01, 29 October 2017 (EDT)
whoa! i didn't know that convert template was that involved... maybe it does a whole lot more conversions than i was looking at to use on this site...
as far as "need" goes, we don't really need it but i thought it would be nice to put standard numerics and have a template to list the different conversions... other than needing to be added to pages where it would be appropriate, it would standardize their display on the page...
Wkitty42 (talk) 11:38, 29 October 2017 (EDT)
Maybe I should rephrase myself, as I did not intend to kill the conversation.
What do we need? Something like {{convert|value|from-unit|to-unit|decimals|hide-unit}} used like {{convert|15|m/s|fps}} to get "49 fps"?
I think it is very much possible to do with what we have. It basically abstracts to a matrix of statements from the two unit switches and math done with Mediawiki's #expr parser function (perm).
ICAO Annex 4 could give some pointers for units, abbreviations and conversion factors.
Sounding a bit like Horay here, but I think converting between the the most used units could most probably be done well within a couple hundred lines of (well formatted and commented) template code (including user documentation).
Johan G (Talk | contribs) 05:04, 11 November 2017 (EST)
An early convert template draft is now available in my sandbox.
Johan G (Talk | contribs) 09:17, 11 November 2017 (EST)